June 15, 2019 at 10:20 am #1852
June 15, 2019 at 10:56 am #1853
Nissa , Who Shakes the World + Genesis Wave would like to say otherwise
*My friends list, more or less, he’s updated since Modern Horizons
Glimpse of nature
Finale of Devastation
ezuri, Renegade leader
Rofellos, llanowar emissary
Survival of the fittest
Chord of calling
Staff of domination
Elvish Spirit guide
Priest of titania
June 15, 2019 at 12:44 pm #1854
Not a bad approach, but what does Nissa get you in the command zone that Garruk doesn’t? The list you post here plays very few lands, and the mana you can gain from untapping a cradle is far more than what you get out of Nissa. On top of this, Garruk is easier to cast, can make bodies, and has a relevant, easy to achieve ultimate. Nissa’s static becomes more relevant after casting a wave or two, but at that point you’re in win-more territory. Getting to cast a big wave the first time around is the important part, and Garruk can set that up just as well and in some cases better. I would argue that this deck is a good Garruk list with the wrong walker in the command zone.
I will point out that my preferred list for elfball is not mono-green, but Samut, Tyrant Smasher. Samut being a built-in Fires of Yavimaya is a fantastic enabler for mana-farting dorks, which may or may not end up the subject of a future article.
- This reply was modified 1 year, 3 months ago by MistahBoweh.
June 15, 2019 at 3:57 pm #1857
Xai LoCommunity Member
I use Nissa Who Shakes the World. She generates a lot of mana for a big G.Waves yes, but I’ve found even faster and more consistent wins with Green Sun’s Zenith.
You ramp out Nissa on turn 2 or 3, and she untaps a forest that can then tap for two which you use to GSZ for Magus of the Candelabra. If Magus has haste (Concordant Crossroads, Thousand-Year Elixir, or Lightning Greaves) you go to town. If not, you wait a turn and then go to town.
Land Enchantments like Wild Growth, Utopia Sprawl, Overgrowth, and Elvish Guidance help with ramp (these will also do really well with your Garruk) Arbor Elf also does well here. And if you have unlimited budget, throw in a Candelabra of Tawnos.
Nissas lands also turn into creatures so Mobilize, Vitalize, and Benefactor’s Drought are great. Earthcraft is awesome too.
Umbral Mantle pretty much wins instantly, but if you don’t have that you simply pump out some mana, and then GSZ for Wirewood Symbiote to untap Magus, then GSZ once more for Temur Sabertooth to flicker Symbiote and keep untapping Magus.
Infinite mana comes on turn 3 or 4 (occasionally turn 2 if you get lucky with Lotus Petal, Chrome Mox, Gemstone Caverns, or Elvish Spirit Guide.) And once you have that you GSZ for Elvish Visionary and then flicker it with Temur Sabertooth to draw the deck. E.Wit is there to recur things, (sometimes you can combo just with Sabertooth/E.Wit/Vitalize) and Finale of Devastation is our finisher to pump everything to infinity and swing with haste. (Finale, Chord, and SumPact are also here to tutor combo pieces in case you don’t have enough mana for more GSZs,).
After 100 goldfish sessions my average win turn was 3.56 but that was without any moxen, earthcraft, Survival of the fittest, Gaea’s Cradle, burgeoning, exploration, or candelabra. Any of those should help. Also I didn’t have any fetchlands which could be used to help thin the deck.
I’m also trying out Rings of Brighthearth now which goes really well with Nissa or with magus. Highly recommend it for your Garruk build.
I challenge you to goldfish your build and see if it can beat 3.5 average turn win.
If I were running Garruk Wildspeaker I might use Crop Rotation for my SS and go straight for Nykthos, and then Deserted Temple to untap Nykthos. I’d made sure to run Arbor Elf, Voyaging Satyr, Magus of the Candelabra, and at least Wild Growth, Utopia Sprawl, and Overgrowth. Hope Tender, Argothian Elder, and Ley Weaver, will all combo with Maze of Ith for infinite mana in combat, so maybe that could be a thing. Although I think I’d just focus on Crop Rotation into Nykthos.
I think the bottle neck is going to be infinite mana without enough card draw. G.Wave or GSZ or even Harmonize might be better but now you aren’t grabbing the lands you need so…. all of this is why my Nissa WStW with GSZ is better 🙂
- This reply was modified 1 year, 3 months ago by Xai Lo.
June 15, 2019 at 11:11 pm #1859
And what happens when Magus gets bolted? Don’t get me wrong, I like the sound of this route, but it sounds fragile. The deck might be a consistent and relatively fast two card combo out of the CZ, but a vacuum is never going to tell you how good a deck is. My Garruk list has a handful of different strategies in order to accommodate for disruption and continue playing the game. Which works best depends on the level of disruption being played in your meta.
Also, I will suggest you run Finale of Devastation and not GSZ. Finale costs an extra G, but can fetch from the graveyard so exile is now your big weakness instead of any spot removal, and with infinimana, has the added bonus of giving infinite damage to all your creatures.
June 16, 2019 at 12:14 am #1861
Xai LoCommunity Member
If Magus gets bolted I have several backups. As it is 20% – 30% of my goldfishing sessions didn’t go infinite with Magus, they went infinite with Priest of Titania, or Rofellos, or often just by bouncing Symbiote to untap a forest (which is also a creature because of Nissa). One animated forest, enchanted with Overgrowth taps for 4 mana which is less than it costs to flicker Symbiote.
Anyway your point is still valid because animated lands are also fragile and can be targeted just as easily as Magus or Priest or Rofellos.
Another 10% – 20% of my comboing out came from flickering E.Wit to recur Mobilize, or Vitalize, or Benefactor’s Draught or Early Harvest. E.Wit can also recur Summoner’s Pact which is nice for building a combo.
Temur Sabertooth is pretty robust, it can bounce other important creatures to my hand to protect them, and in doing so makes it indestructible so exile is really the only worry there. All of that at instant speed and without needing haste because it’s not a tap ability. But my lands and dorks and untappers are all small dudes so that is a concern unless Sabertooth is out.
At the end of the day you are correct when you say that goldfishing won’t actually give a good idea about how a deck performs. I just know that without removal I have the potential for Turn 2 wins and almost a 50% chance of Turn 3 wins. I just need to find a playgroup to really test this thing out!